Re: Latin il+C, ir+C, etymology

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski <gpiotr@...> wrote:

>
> On 2008-07-27 17:29, Joao S. Lopes wrote:
> >
> >
> > What's the etymological explanation for Latin words of il+C, ir+C?

Why

> > "I" and not "U" or "E"? Examples:
> > gilvus "greyish"
> > milvus "kite"
> > silva "woods"
> > firmus "firm"
> > hircus "buck"
> > hirtus "rough-haired"
> >
> > ilvus < *ilowo- ?
>
> The /i/ in <firmus> alternates with the /e/ of <ferme:> (*dHer-mo-),

I don't think these can be separated from form-; after the reduction
of unstressed o > e in *enfermo- the words could be formed by analogy.

> <gilvus> seems to be a loan (from Celtic?) related to <helvus>;

<hircus>

> (Sab. fircus) and other "hirsute" words belong with *g^Her- 'bristle'
> (as in Gk. kHe:r, Lat. e:r 'hedgehog'), accordding to Pokorny (perhaps
> *g^Her-h3kW-o-, cf. hirqui:nus),

Most likely analogy with equi:nus.

so it seems that we occasionally get

> (dialectal?) Lat. /i/ from *e before a liquid in a closed syllable.

Since e>i in many other positions (in-, Minerva, simplex, vitulus) I
don't think anything needs to be said but "optional" for the various
environments.

> Weiss says mi:lvus < mi:luus (with an etymological *i:), but gives no
> details.

But irl > i:l seems likely.