Re: Slav names from *Walh-

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alexandru_mg3" <alexandru_mg3@...>
wrote:

>
> --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alexandru_mg3" <alexandru_mg3@>
> wrote:
> >
> > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alexandru_mg3" <alexandru_mg3@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Miguel Carrasquer Vidal
> > > <miguelc@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 26 Mar 2008 17:03:19 -0000, "tgpedersen"
> > > > <tgpedersen@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >I know the various Polish and Russian names from PGmc. *walh.
> > > > >"southern foreigner" in -lo-/-olo- probably follow ordinary
> > rules
> > > of
> > > > >derivation from Proto-Proto-Slav. -al-.
> > > > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etymology_of_Vlach
> > > > >I just want to be sure: Are we absolutely certain all Slavic
> > forms
> > > > >from Germanic *walh- are from exactly that form in -al- and

not

> > > > >something earlier (I'm thinking of the original -ol- in

Celtic

> > > Volcae)?
> > > >
> > > > Since Slavic did not distinguish between /o/ and /a/, that
> > > > would be hard to tell. The /h/, however, shows it was
> > > > borrowed from Germanic *walh-.
> > > >
> > > > =======================
> > > > Miguel Carrasquer Vidal
> > > > miguelc@
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ... and if you will go further Vallachia is finally linked with
> > > Walhalla - the great hall in Norse mythology where heroes slain
> in
> > > battle are received
> > >
> > > http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/valhalla
> > >
> > > Marius
> > >
> >
> >
> > Valhalla
> > heavenly hall in which Odin receives the souls of heroes slain in
> > battle, 1768, from O.N. Valhöll "hall of the battle-slain;" first
> > element from valr "those slain in battle,"
> >
> > "
> > from P.Gmc. *walaz (cf. O.E. wæl "slaughter, bodies of the

slain,"

> > O.H.G. wal "battlefield, slaughter"),
> > from PIE base *wele- "to strike, wound"
> > (cf. Avestan vareta- "seized, prisoner,"
> > L. veles "ghosts of the dead,"
> > O.Ir. fuil "blood,"
> > Welsh gwel "wound").
> >
> > Second element is from höll "hall," from PIE base *kel- "to
> conceal"
> > (see cell). Reintroduced by 18c. antiquaries. Figurative sense is
> > from 1845
> > "
> >
> > http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=Valhalla
> >
> > Marius
> >
>
> Matasovic for Celtic Cognates
>
> "Proto-Indo-European: *welh2/3- 'wound'
>
> Proto-Celtic: *weli- 'blood' [Noun]
>
> Old Irish: fuil [i f]
>
> Middle Welsh: gweli 'blood, wound'
>
> Middle Breton: goulyow [p]
>
> Cornish: goly
>
> Page in Pokorny: 1144f.
>
> IE cognates: Lat. uolnus, Gr. oulḗ 'scar'
>
> Notes: The laryngeal is implied by Lat. -ln- (from *-lan- by

syncope;

> original *ln would have been assimilated to ll, cp. tollo 'take' <
> *tolnō). W gweli and the other British forms cannot be derived
> directly from the proto-form *weli-, but rather presuppose some

kind

> of suffix, perhaps *-īso- (Pokorny).
>
> References: De Bernardo Stempel 1999: 65, 73, EIEC 650.
> "
>
>
> Marius

Valfather: Odin as "father of the slain." Old Norse (ON) valr
= "slaughter, corpses, those slain in battle," cognate with Old
English (OE) wæl. "[Odin] is called 'Valfather' because all who fall
in battle are his adopted sons; he assigns them places in Valhalla
['Hall of the Slain'] ... and they are then called Einherjar" (Gylf
20).


You can compare this with Herodotus regarding Zalmoxis:

"But before he came to the Ister, he first subdued the Getae, who
pretend to be immortal. The Thracians of Salmydessus and of the
country above the towns of Appolonia and Mesambria, who are called
Cyrmaianae and Nipsaei, surrendered themselves unresisting to Darius;
but the Getae, who are the bravest and most law-abiding of all
Thracians, resisted with obstinacy, and were enslaved forthwith.

94. As to their claim to be immortal, this is how they show it: they
believe that they do not die, but that he who perishes goes to the
god Salmoxis or Gebelexis, as some of them call him. Once in every
five years they choose by lot one of their people and send him as a
messenger to Salmoxis, charged to tell of their needs; and this is
their manner of sending: Three lances are held by men thereto
appointed; others seize the messenger to Salmoxis by his hands and
feet, and swing and hurl him aloft on to the spear-point. If he be
killed by the cast, they believe that the gods regard them with
favour; but if he be not killed, they blame the messenger himself,
deeming him a bad man, and send another messenger in place of him
whom they blame. It is while the man yet lives that they charge him
with the message.
"

Marius