[tied] Re: Proto Vedic Continuity Theory of Bharatiya (Indian) Lang

From: mkelkar2003
Message: 41882
Date: 2005-11-08

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel J. Milton" <dmilt1896@...>
wrote:
>
> Reading the paper that has been cited in several postings:
> <http://www.genome.org/cgi/content/abstract/11/6/994>
>
> I'll copy it to make it simple:
> Genetic Evidence on the Origins of Indian Caste Populations
> Michael Bamshad,1,10,12 Toomas Kivisild,2 W. Scott Watkins,3 Mary E.
> Dixon,3 Chris E. Ricker,3 Baskara B. Rao,4 J. Mastan Naidu,4 B.V. Ravi
> Prasad,4,5 P. Govinda Reddy,6 Arani Rasanayagam,7 Surinder S. Papiha,8
> Richard Villems,2 Alan J. Redd,7 Michael F. Hammer,7 Son V. Nguyen,9
> Marion L. Carroll,9 Mark A. Batzer,9,11 and Lynn B. Jorde3
>
> 1 Department of Pediatrics, University of Utah, Salt Lake City, Utah
> 84112, USA; 2 Institute of Molecular and Cell Biology, Tartu
> University and Estonian Biocentre, Tartu 51010, Estonia; 3 Department
> of Human Genetics, University of Utah, Salt Lake City, Utah 84112,
> USA; 4 Department of Anthropology, Andhra University, Visakhapatnam,
> Andhra Pradesh, India; 5 Anthropological Survey of India, Calcutta,
> India; 6 Department of Anthropology, University of Madras, Madras,
> Tamil Nadu, India; 7 Laboratory of Molecular Systematics and
> Evolution, University of Arizona, Tucson, Arizona 85721, USA; 8
> Department of Human Genetics, University of Newcastle-upon-Tyne, UK; 9
> Department of Pathology, Biometry and Genetics, Biochemistry and
> Molecular Biology, Stanley S. Scott Cancer Center, Louisiana State
> University Health Science Center, New Orleans, Louisiana 70112, USA
>
> The origins and affinities of the ~1 billion people living on the
> subcontinent of India have long been contested. This is owing, in
> part, to the many different waves of immigrants that have influenced
> the genetic structure of India. In the most recent of these waves,
> Indo-European-speaking people from West Eurasia entered India from the
> Northwest and diffused throughout the subcontinent. They purportedly
> admixed with or displaced indigenous Dravidic-speaking populations.
> Subsequently they may have established the Hindu caste system and
> placed themselves primarily in castes of higher rank. To explore the
> impact of West Eurasians on contemporary Indian caste populations, we
> compared mtDNA (400 bp of hypervariable region 1 and 14 restriction
> site polymorphisms) and Y-chromosome (20 biallelic polymorphisms and 5
> short tandem repeats) variation in ~265 males from eight castes of
> different rank to ~750 Africans, Asians, Europeans, and other Indians.
> For maternally inherited mtDNA, each caste is most similar to Asians.
> However, 20%-30% of Indian mtDNA haplotypes belong to West Eurasian
> haplogroups, and the frequency of these haplotypes is proportional to
> caste rank, the highest frequency of West Eurasian haplotypes being
> found in the upper castes. In contrast, for paternally inherited
> Y-chromosome variation each caste is more similar to Europeans than to
> Asians. Moreover, the affinity to Europeans is proportionate to caste
> rank, the upper castes being most similar to Europeans, particularly
> East Europeans. These findings are consistent with greater West
> Eurasian male admixture with castes of higher rank. Nevertheless, the
> mitochondrial genome and the Y chromosome each represents only a
> single haploid locus and is more susceptible to large stochastic
> variation, bottlenecks, and selective sweeps. Thus, to increase the
> power of our analysis, we assayed 40 independent, biparentally
> inherited autosomal loci (1 LINE-1 and 39 Alu elements) in all of the
> caste and continental populations (~600 individuals). Analysis of
> these data demonstrated that the upper castes have a higher affinity
> to Europeans than to Asians, and the upper castes are significantly
> more similar to Europeans than are the lower castes. Collectively, all
> five datasets show a trend toward upper castes being more similar to
> Europeans, whereas lower castes are more similar to Asians. We
> conclude that Indian castes are most likely to be of proto-Asian
> origin with West Eurasian admixture resulting in rank-related and
> sex-specific differences in the genetic affinities of castes to Asians
> and Europeans. (end copy)
>
> Doesn't an admixture of European-like chromosomes in the higher
> castes of India point to the ancestors thereof being intrusive; and
> moreover that this shows in the male rather than female chromosomes,
> not simply immigrants, but invaders?
> Is there any other reasonable interpretation?
> Dan
>

Please refer to message # 41875 for a detailed critique of Bamshad
done by Kivislid and his team. The Indian subcontinent contains all
the genetic diversity of Central Asia and Europe and *then some.*
Therefore these groups are going to match on some characteristic. The
true genetic picture of the Indian subcontinent is offered by
Oppenheimer (2003) who considers the genetic data in total (p. 26, 27,
48, 49, of proto-vedic continuity.doc files section of Cybalist). Thanks!

M. Kelkar