Re: [tied] russian vor [was: IE thematic presents and the origin of

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski <gpiotr@...> wrote:

> Grzegorz Jagodzinski wrote:
>
> >>>... I
> >>>vaguely remember that the word is an early Finnic
> >>>loan in Russian, cf.
> >>>Finnish varas.
> >
> >
> > Vasmer denies it.
>
> Yes, but why? Because of the Germanic connections of varas/varkaan? How
> does that affect the possibility that the Finnic nom.sg. varas was
> borrowed as *vorU into early Russian?
>
> > Vasmer believes this word to be related with Greek rhe:tor and

esp. eiro:n <

> > *erio:n "a man who says different things than he thinks", "liar".

Trubachev

> > comments that this word is only Great Russian and it can be

related with

> > vre^ti 'to boil' or with za-veret' 'to close' (ibidem).
>
> Again, the limited geographical distribution of the word makes me

prefer

> the Finnic loan hypothesis to any of those fanciful PIE etymologies,
> which, needless to say, can't all be true.
>
> Piotr

Finnish also has 'voro' thief, but it's borrowed from Russian (Suomen
Sanojen Alkuperä). I don't know how it entered Russian. Back and
forth borrowings are possible, I guess.

Peter P