Re[6]: ka and k^a [was: [tied] *kW- "?"]

From: Brian M. Scott
Message: 40560
Date: 2005-09-24

At 10:54:35 PM on Friday, September 23, 2005, Patrick Ryan
wrote:

> From: "Brian M. Scott" <BMScott@...>

>> At 8:49:39 PM on Friday, September 23, 2005, Patrick Ryan
>> wrote:

>>>>> And even then, in only _15%_ of the instances does [t]
>>>>> become [?] -

>>>> You mean that /t/ is realized as [?]; there was no [t] in
>>>> the first place in these utterances.

>>> Read it again. What does "final-/t/" mean? OOPS! How
>>> obvious! It does not mean /t/.

>> Why yes, it *does* mean /t/, when the choice is between that
>> and the [t] that you wrote; it just doesn't refer to all
>> instances of /t/.

> How naïf! [t] does not occur in GA unless it reflects <t>
> and /t/.

If it be naive to distinguish brackets from slants, I
cheerfully acknowledge my naiveté, while pointing out that
your last two responses here are both non sequiturs.

>>>> And at least one of the references that I cited a few
>>>> hours ago adds some independent data. The Dautricourt
>>>> abstract notes that:

>>>> In a dataset consisting of over 400 tokens, comprising all
>>>> /t,d#y/ word pairs in hour-long interviews with 16
>>>> speakers, four variants predominated in the following
>>>> decreasing order of frequency: glottal stop, palatal
>>>> affricates, alveolar stops, and (alveolar stop) deletion.

>>> This does not bear on the question.

>> On the contrary, it is (in part) precisely to the point, as
>> it refers to a subset of the class of syllable-final /t/
>> (and /d/, which indeed is not directly to the point).

> Then tell me, O better reader, what percentage of the
> people in the study _use_ [?] for final /t/; and how
> often.

As one would expect, the abstract omits the detailed data.
None the less, there is an obvious conclusion to be drawn
from 'decreasing order of frequency' followed by a list that
begins 'glottal stop'. And just very little searching
on-line turns up
<ling.ohio-state.edu/~rdautric/Presentations/LSA2004/LSA2004.ppt>,
where you can see some of the data for yourself. Of 136
tokens of the /t#y/ type, 81, or just under 60%, had glottal
realization of the /t/.

Brian