Re: Voiced affricatives in English dialects [was: re [tied] Animate

From: tgpedersen
Message: 25540
Date: 2003-09-05

--- In, Gordon Selway <gordonselway@...>
> A discursive contribution, only to point out that the voiced
> affricatives [z for standard s, v for f, the 'th' in eg 'thumb' as
> 'the', not as std. 'throat'] which it is suggested occur in
> (and I suppose they may still do so in out-of-the-way parts of the
> county) were once very much more widespread in south-
> English, but have been receding at perhaps five km a decade for the
> past couple of centuries.
> I do not recall it occurring in the speech of my father, or of my
> uncles fifty years ago, though some
> archaic features were present. Text books suggest iirc that it
> stopped being the usual pronunciation in the Forest of Dean and
> Herefordshire about 150 years ago, and in Worcestershire a century
> earlier, though as I have none to hand I cannot verify my
> The phenomenon may occur with the initial consonant of a component
> a word: 'Zummerzet'.
> With kind regards,
> Gordon Selway
> <gordonselway@...>

Thanks for the information! Was it once widespread enough that one
might hypothetically characterise it as a distinguishing feature
between Saxon and "Anglian", given the historic settlements of those