Re: [tied] Enclosed Places (was: The unexplained link between Greek

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski
<piotr.gasiorowski@...> wrote:

> 12-07-03 22:15, Abdullah Konushevci wrote:
>
> > PIE root *g^hordh- derives in Albanian <gardh> 'hedge, fence',
> > through regular changes /*o/ > /a/ and /-rd-/ > /-rdh-/. This

word

> > is preserved in place name Zgërdhesh < s- + gardh + -esh, one of
> > oldest toponym.
>
> Some of the oldest -- in what sense?
>
> > So, in most ancient words, that couldn't be a loans, exept for

non-

> > scientific reasons, as you see, the rule that palatals derives

in

> > Albanian always interdentals, is not true.
>
> Whay can't it be a loan? What's unscientific about such a

possibility?

> Anyway, Slavic has *gordU as well, which to my mind suggests that

either

> Slavic and Albanian borrowed the word separatly from a similar non-

Satem

> source (Germanic?) or Albanian (and Romanian) borrowed it from

early

> (pre-metathesis) Slavic, which took it from Germanic.
>
> Piotr

************
About place name Zgërdhesh (for the same toponymic paradigm see:
Arbnesh, Kurvelesh, Martanesh, Padesh, Makresh, Vaganesh, Golesh,
Bitesh, etc.) it's worth mentioned that it is Albanian name for the
Albanopolis (first was mentioned by Ptolemy in the mid-2d century
AD. There is a church dedicated to Saint Martin and there are no
data that was ever under any Slavic impact.
For me, the name has just Albanian form Zgërdhesh of Greek
<polis> 'city' < Albanopolis.
I support and, furthermore, I believe that in IE studies we must
keep as axiom Delamarre's claim that every day's word couldn't be
loans from other languages, otherwise we couldn't pretend in Proto-
Indo-European language as a mother language.
And, at last, Proto-Albanians tribes was much early, speaking
historically, in contact with Germanic tribes, especially with
Goths, then Slavic tribes in the Ballkans.

Konushevci