Re: Alb. "dirt"

--- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "alex_lycos" <altamix@...> wrote:

> Abdullah, there is the albanian word for "dirt" which is "murdar".
> Is this word seen too as turkish loan into Albanian?
> I wonder about this word since the form is exactly as the form in

the IE

> languages for "dirt"
> see Latin: merdalus with derivative "merda" preserved in Romance (

but

> not in Rom.). Greek "smerdaleus", Lith. "smardas", etc.
>
> I asked my colleague what does mean in turkish "dirt" , "unclean",
> "impur" and she told me about "kirli", "pis", and she said the word
> "murdar" is unknown to her.
> Of course the words exist in Turkish and has the meaning of
> "murdar"(dirt, unclean, impure).
> It is the question if this word which has the same form in Rom. ,
> Albanian and Turkish is a word loaned into the Turkish language (

see

> the fact a simply speaker knew the turkish words [kirli,pis] but

not the

> word [murdar]) or if indeed this word was loaned by Albanians and
> Romanians from Turks.
> I am a bit confused since the turkish word has the same stem as the

IE

> one *(s)mVrd.
> alex

************
'Murdar' is persian loan in Turkish meaning 'corpse, dead body,
cadaver'. I am afraid it's compound <mur> (cf. mors, -tis 'death')
and present stem of verb <dashten> (all paradigm: daram, dari, darad,
darim, darid, darand 'I/you/he/she/we/You/they 'have') 'to have, to
posses' (cf. dizdar 'castle's holder', bayrakdar 'flagkeeper',
tahsildar 'tax-collector', serdar < ser 'head' and -dar 'commander'),
etc.
Couriuosly, Alb. verb dëlir 'clean' is metathetic form of lëdir 'to
clean' (cf. lëbyr 'to veil, to dazzle', present also in Dalmatian
buriti 'id.' and in Romanian, lëvar 'to bend', lëmek 'to moisten, to
weaken') and it seems like English <to dirt>. Otherwise, <to dirt> in
Albanian is 'fëlliq' very similar to English <to filth>.

Konushevci