[tied] Re: IE *pe-mn

In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, "altamix" wrote:

> In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Miguel Carrasquer <mcv@...> wrote:
>
>
>>> After the fall of "v" ( accepting it went) we have the form
>>>"*paimentum".
>>
>> Not at all. Latin paviméntum should have given pavméntu (> pãmînt),
>> just like monuméntu gives mormînt and veteránu gives bãtrân.
>> The "v" (/B/) was assimilated to the /m/ in this case.

For the sake of the argument, I have to mention that similar
arguments were brought into discussion on another list; alas,
with poor results as one can see. Same arguments were brought
also on this list (with identical vanishing effect, for instance
see my post http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/16095).

> I don't see what has "monumentum" to look here. The sincope of
> the "e" is usually accepted, the sincope of "u" too?

The accepted thing is possible fall of unstressed vowels (with
higher probability between "muta cum liquida", but also in other
phonetical contexts). This phenomenon is often encountered in
pretonic syllable.

> Since you speak about "mormânt" , you have to keep in mind the
> word "morman" which seems to be the word wherefrom the "mormânt"
> derive, which is more appropiate semanticaly & phonologicaly
> as "monumentum".

Of course, this was discussed too and everything had plenty of
time to be totally forgotten since then. "monumentum" appears in
Latin texts as "sepultus est in monumento avunculi sui" with a
perfect semantical match. The phonetic derivation was discussed
not so widely, but gives no pain as far as "morimentum" is an
atested word in Latin inscriptions on graves for "monumentum";
hence morimentum > mormentu > mormântu > mormânt (DR).
"morman" _seems to be the etymon of "mormânt"_ only for Alex
and (maybe) Vinereanu.

Cheers,
Marius Iacomi