--- In
cybalist@yahoogroups.com, Piotr Gasiorowski
<piotr.gasiorowski@...> wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "tgpedersen" <tgpedersen@...>
>
>
> > T: And if we assume that the input was *p, *s, *t, *k, *kW, we
get an accentually conditioned rule of fricative and occlusive
voicing.
>
P:> ... which affects non-glottalised occlusives only, though,
according to your schema, the glottalised ones are voiceless as well.
The reformulation is disjunctive (VL no longer applies to a natural
class of consonants) and therefore inferior to the traditional
version.
>
T: Ok, you may be right here, I'll have to use [-voiced][-
glottalised] instead of just [-voiced]. But if I postulate a North
German Knacklaut as word-divider /#/ (cf. Tacitus' 'murmur fractum',
and see that as related to the interruption of air flow in
glottalisation, I might capture the word boundary condition of Verner
too (no voicing in wordinitial continuants, unlike later Dutch and
German).
> > T: Simplicity comes at a price.
>
P: There is no such price attached to the traditional formulation of
VL. It's satisfactory as it is.
T: Different strokes for different folks. At least I don't
hypostatize my personal opinions to communis opinio.
>
> > P: You apparently would like to do so in order to leave an escape
gate for your "Tungri = Thuringi" idea, but that's a poor
justification from anyone else's point of view.
T: Did you just take a poll? Should polls be taken here? So many
questions.
>
> > T: Please excuse my anti-social rule; but it works.
>
> _You_ claim it works, meaning, I suppose, that the result has been
forced to fit your "Tungrian" proposal (a circular feat, because that
was the _only_ purpose of the whole exercise).
Hm. You never propose rules to fit a particular example? And
personally, that's not the way I draw circles.
>But it's unsatisfactory on linguistic grounds. Apart from problems
already mentioned, it critically depends on the acceptance of a
glottalic model of pre-Germanic, which is untenable.
People would disagree here. And I'm afraid you're up against greater
minds than mine. I didn't invent the glottalic theory and there are
people who push it indendently of my 'Tungri' proposal.
> Piotr
Torsten