--- "Daniel J. Milton" <
dmilt1896@...> wrote:
> In my postings I neglected George's question 1).
> If 'tyrannos' was Hattian or Hittite, and entered
> Greek at the
> time of Archilochos, and the Philistines were
> Mycenaean Greeks, then
> no, 'seren' should not be the same as 'tyrannos.'
> Of course there's an alternative: if 'seren' is
> the same
> as 'tyrannos', then the Philistines might have been
> Hattian or
> Hittite and not Greeks.
> It all seems to me a slender reed, if you're
> trying to draw major
> conclusions!
> Dan
*****GK: I'd love to be able to draw any conclusions,
major or minor (:=))). The reason I raised this
"Seren" point is that it seems just about the only
Philistine word (non-Semitic) to have survived, other
than some personal names. I rather doubt the Ph. were
Mycenaean Greeks (despite the pottery argument). And
their origin from "Kaphtor" (which doesn't necessarily
stand only for Crete) remains obscure. All we know is
that they suddenly appear in Egyptian records under
their name (sometime in the first third of the 12th c.
BC), that they are a component of the "People of the
Sea" (whatever that was: perhaps "People who came
across the Sea" were included. The first big battle
with the Egyptians under Rameses III was a LAND
battle, with people whose women and children travelled
along with them in ox-drawn carts...). Anyway, of the
many theories about Philistine origins, the most
defensible seem to be those which link them with the
North. Anatolia is mentioned (not just the Aegean
Sea), and if Crete was truly relevant, it could have
been a staging post as well as a point of origin. Of
course the Philistines were likely a fairly mixed lot
(even independently of the local Canaanites they
absorbed). And there were massive populations
movements from North to South/SouthEast in the
13th/12th c. BC >No point in repeating what is
generally known here. What I find quite interesting,
as a Scythian oriented researcher, is that among these
"People of the Sea" (and perhaps among the
Philistines) there might have been elements which
originated from the area north of the Black Sea.
Ukrainian archaeologists noted quite recently that the
early "Zrubna" culture WEST (the eastern component
stayed and continued to develop into Cimmeria etc.) of
the Dnipro/Dniepr (its "Sabatynivka" variant of ca.
1400-1200 BC) suddenly dissipated in the 13th c., as
if a massive out-migration had occurred. The 14th/13th
c. Sabatynivka graves have some warrior artifacts and
depictions on objects which are strangely reminiscent
of Cretan and Philistine items. And I still am not
quite certain as to what has priority, the Philistine
mermaid goddess Derketo, or the Scythian serpmaid
Targita, whom they associated in their 7th c. century
BC odyssey with the Temple of Ashkelon. Lots of
questions. And the SEREN word is just small part of
this.******
>
> > > --- In cybalist@yahoogroups.com, george knysh
> <gknysh@...>
> wrote:
> > > > There are claims that the Philistine term for
> "Lord"
> > > > =SEREN is allegedly the same as Hittite
> TARWANNAS,
> > > > SARAWANAS and Greek TYRANNOS. (1) is this
> correct? (2)
> > > > is there an IE etymoilogy for it, or is it
> non-IE?
>
>
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