Re[4]: [tied] English "voiced" stops

At 2:15:52 PM on Tuesday, February 25, 2003, Patrick C. Ryan
wrote:

>> 'Very little' includes 'none' as a special case.

> Not in my dialect or logic. "very little" means that there
> is "some".

It can in mine as well, but not in 'Most people have very
little voicing going on while the lips are closed during
either "pie" or "buy"'. A little sensitivity to context
and overall sense is useful.

>>>> Most speakers of American English have no voicing
>>>> during the closure of so-called voiced stops in
>>>> sentence initial position.

> Are you prepared to assure me that "most" here means 50+%?

No; I'm not a mind-reader. I think it very likely, however,
that that is how Ladefoged meant it, since his English is
not obviously idiosyncratic.

>>> Ladefoged is simply wrong on "most" though, I admit, it
>>> obviously happens in ethnic enclaves.

Once again: Of what kind(s)?

>> And why is your view to be preferred to that of a
>> specialist with decades of experience?

> Experts assured us the world was flat some years ago.

Not in the last 2000+ years.

Brian