--- George S t a n a <
gs001ns@...> wrote:
>
>(Alex): >None of these people identifies themself as
cuman,
> pechengs or
> >avars ( some people suppose the shekelers are the
> old avars).
>
>(George): Not even Hungarians of Kuns�g ("Cumania")
in
> South-East Hungary
> (in the Tisza plains, up to Szeged), although this
> part of population
> has Cuman extraction as well: the chronicles say
> that in the 30s
> of the 13th century "40" thousand tents moved from
> what's now
> Moldavia (incl. today's Republic of Moldova) to
> Hungary, and
> that in the 80s-90s of the same century one parte of
> them went
> back to Ukraine disappearing in the Turkic
> configurations of
> the "Golden Horde". But many Cumans stayed put.
*****GK: I once met a very patriotic Crimean Tatar
activist called Aishe Seitmuratova (a wonderful person
in every respect, one of the Soviet "dissidents" of
that age== met her at the Madrid gathering of such in
1980, just hours after Amalrik had been killed in an
auto acccident in the Pyrenees).== She claimed that
the Crimean Tatars were the direct descendants of the
Cumans, since the Asiatic Tatars of the 1240's etc..
only constituted a small part of the population of the
Golden Horde, most of which were integrated Cumanic
clans.[as we know the pre-1944 Crimean Tartars
comprised not only the descendants of the "steppe"
people, but also the very "European looking"
descendants of Goths, Alans, Greeks etc etc, with a
proportion of roughly 1:1. But I felt I shouldn't
press the point with Aishe]. Aishe went on to argue
that the Cuman(Polovtsian) history recoverable in Old
Ukrainian, Byzantine etc., texts should be considered
a part of Crimean Tatar history, that individuals such
as Konchak, Bonyak, Tugorkan etc were actually
"Crimean Khans". She showed me maps where the
historical "Tataria" included half of Ukraine, but
then reassured me in her gentle way (:=)) that all
they wanted was autonomy in the Crimea.*******
>
> George
>
>
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