[tied] Re: PK

--- In cybalist@..., Miguel Carrasquer <mcv@...> wrote:

> On Mon, 02 Sep 2002 17:43:41 -0000, "richardwordingham"
> <richard.wordingham@...> wrote:
>
> >--- Miguel Carrasquer wrote:
> >Miguel:
> >> while PIE *kWétwor- "four", pre-PIE **pWét-wa:r- <

**pút- can be

> >compared to Afro-Asiatic *p.ut.-/*?a-p.t.- "four" (Chadic *fud.u,
> >Eg. ?ftaw,
>
> Correction *?fdaw (where <d> was emphatic /t./).
>
> >Beja fad.-ig, Somali ?afar, Semitic (with metathesis) *?arb-a3-).
> >
> >To demonstrate IE *pW, the words for 'four' don't even have to be
> >cognate! I think a loan between the ancestral languages is
> >plausible. Someone please correct me if I am wrong.
>
> True, borrowings will also do. The most likely source of

borrowing, Semitic, is

> problematic in this case, however (?arba3u, with metathesis *?ap.t.-
> *?at.p.-
> > *?adb- > ?arb-, and a what's the `ayn doing there?), while

Egyptian (not

> likely, but possible) has *?fdw < *?ap.t-. The best fit is Chadic,

but somehow

> a PIE-Chadic borrowing seems unlikely. I find it encouraging that

there's also

> a plausible link between AA and IE "3": "PN" *tiláti > PAA

*c^ala:c^ > Sem.

> *t_ala:t_ // PPIE *t^lát^ > *trét^- > PIE *trey- (ordinal

tr.t-yós).

I was thinking in terms of the more recent date of 8000-6000 BC for
the Afro-Asiatic split, as discussed in
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cybalist/message/2612 . This would
allow a loan between proto-AA and an ancestor of PIE. (I accept
Renfrew's theory for IE origins.)

I'm beginning to have some qualms about liver ~ spleen. I was
thinking of liver ~ pancreas. Is the use of a word for liver to
refer to the spleen attested? I have a vague suspicion that
Thai 'tap lek', literally 'iron liver', might mean 'spleen', but I
can't find it in my dictionaries. Does anyone on the list know Thai
well enough to answer?

Richard.