Re: [tied] Affects of immigrant communities in language change

>Good God Glen don't go medieval on me

My trailing e-signature should tell you that I'm already
"bEsErk" :P

>However, I'm trying to ascertain the direction of influence. You
>didn't provide evidence of this.

Alright. Thanx for clarifying. Basically, I was suggesting
possible Tyrrhenian to Germanic influence at an early date.
Tyrrhenian being a mostly initial-stress language and having
fricatives, it would seem like a good candidate. However,
Finnic does have all these features too... I have to go now,
my mommy's calling me. I'll think some more on what exactly
my position should be.

-------------------------------------------------
gLeNny gEe
...wEbDeVEr gOne bEsErK!

home: http://glen_gordon.tripod.com
email: glengordon01@...
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>
>Etruscan-Lemnos or Lemnos-Etruscan
>
>As you know, it's key to your theory
>
>I'll send the Herodot word for word later. For now...
>
>From what I've translated so far Herodotus
>records a western Anatolian tradition about an
>extensive drought that occurs, as or just before,
>the Ludi polity consolidates. Apparently, prior to this the
>this region was controlled by the Meii. Despite attempts
>to divine or influence the course of the drought it
>continues for 18 years. The Ludi king forces the
>abandonment of a district and this population constructs
>a fleet and resettles in Umbria, Italy. A Ludi king named
>Turs�ni�n heads the expedition to Italy.
>
>1) The Ludi-Lydians appear to be Luwians.
>2) The name of the Ludi king Atya or Attu appears similar to the
>Luwian words adduwali or at, which mean angry and eat, respectively.
>3) This Attu has been confused with a son of the 6th century
>Lydian Croesus.
>4) The drought, abandonment, and migration story sounds like a
>Late Bronze Age setting.
>
>I have no problem with a tradition about abandonments in western
>Anatolia and their resettlement in Italy in the LB. However, this
>particular tradition, as told, doesn't say anything about this
>populations language being different or unusual. Interestingly,
>Herodotus does say that the language of the population of Lemnos and
>Imbros is different from all others, calling them Pelasgians-Pelasgon.
>
>Herodotus recounts that the Pelasgi were the dominant population in
>Greece before the Dorian migration. He also says something about the
>Ionians of Attica, at one time, being Pelasgi, but later they adopted
>the Hellenic lingo.
>
>I've found a number of Classical references that also place
>Pelasgi-speaking populations in Attica, Thessalonian, Epirus, Thrace,
>Argos, Peloponnesus, and Crete. Herodotus also says that the people
>that lived north of the Tyrsenans in Italy were Pelasgi.
>
>Now this may be totally off target, because it seems to have nothing
>to do with the Etruscans, but you may fine this interesting. Its the
>names of the Sea People, from Egypt, that where associated with a
>Late Bronze Age mass migration that hit the eastern Mediterranean in
>the late 13th and early 12th centuries.
>
>A-qi-ya-wa-sa/ A-qi-wa-sa/
>Rendered as Ekwesh or Achewash
>[Greece and Aegean (as Achaean)-Homeric ethnic name, Palestine]
>
>Danuna (D-y-n-yw-n)
>Rendered as Danaan
>[Argos (Danaus) and northwest Anatolia (Dardanaus)-Homeric ethnic
>name, Dan-Palestine]
>
>Wasasa (W-s-s)
>Rendered as Washesh or Wassos
>[Western Anatolia-Lydian-Homeric ethnic name, Asher-Palestine]
>
>Tjikar (T-k-k[-r])
>Rendered as Tjekker or Teukori
>[Northwestern Anatolia Homeric ethnic name (Teuthrians or Teukrians)
>and Dor-Palestine]
>
>Sa-k(a)-ru-su (s'-r'-rw-s')
>Rendered as Sheklesh or Siekli
>[Palestine, Sicily-Italy]
>
>Ta-ru-sa (Tw-rw-s'/ Tw-ry-s')
>Rendered as Tursha, Tyrsha, or Ta-rasna (prefix ta and see Rw-ku
>below)[North west Anatolia-Homeric ethnic name, Palestine, Umbria-
>Italy]
>
>Sa-ra-d-n/ Sa-ar-di-na (S'-r'd-n)
>Rendered as Shardin
>[Sardis-Lydian western Anatolia, Akko-Palestine, Sardinia-Italy]
>
>Pe-ra-sa-ta/ Peleset (Pw-r-s-ty)
>Rendered as Pelesti
>[Pelesgi-Aegean, Philistine-Palestine,
>Tuscany-Italy]
>
>Rw-ku (Rw-kw)
>Rendered as Rawkaw
>[western Anatolia-Lydian (Luwian-Razawa also formerly translated as
>Arzawa), Palestine, Rasna or Rasenna-Italy (the name the Etruscan
>called themselves)]
>
>
>I'm not sure if this would hold up, however it suggests that this
>is a rather complex period and that a number of sea born populations
>from the Aegean and western Anatolia fan out in a huge migration
>throughout the eastern and middle Mediterranean in the late stage of
>LB.
>
>This information gives your theory a basis in the Aegean and western
>Anatolia. Still is there any evidence from the southern or western
>Balkans?
>
>
>JS Crary
>
>

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