Glen Gordon writes:
>EtruscoLemnian is closer to Anatolian more than anything and >contains both
>these suffixes. By viewing IndoEtruscan as originating >from the
>Pontic-Caspian, EtruscoLemnian therefore must have >travelled (before the
>Anatolians did) to the Balkans in order for >Etruscan to end up in Italy
>further west.
Mark:
>No. Herodotus, in The Histories, 1:94, states the Tyrrhennians (=
> >Etrurians = Etruscans [= 'Tuscans']) originated in Lydia, in Asia >Minor.
Well, anyways, they originated from the Pontic-Caspian.
>This view tends to be seconded by modern writers, to a large extent
> >because of the inscriptions found on Lemnos. It's easier to have
> >Tyrrhenians migrating from an Asia Minor homeland to nearby Lemnos >as
>well as much more distant Etruria in Italy than it is to explain >how
>natives of Italy got to Lemnos. My reading suggests they would >have
>migrated by sea during the time of the Sea Peoples, sometime >after 1000
>BCE.
I never said that Lemnians came from Italy. I state clearly the
Pontic-Caspian. If these EtruscoLemnians then reached Asia Minor, so be it,
but they must have done so via the Balkans in some remote past within the
last 6,000 years.
>The identification of the Pelasgian Language[s] as a part of the
> >Tyrrhenian family of languages (Etruscan, Rhaetian, Lemnian) is, as >I
>said in an earlier posting, a not unreasonable guess, but it's >just a
>guess, based on the proximity of the attested Lemnian >language on Lemnos
>and the testimony from antiquity about the >presence of Pelasgians in the
>same place at the same time.
No. Based on attested similarities which I remember coming across.
>As for the Etruscan language itself, it remains undeciphered.
No. It is partially deciphered with a fair amount of terms and grammatical
items that surely must be a strong basis for connection to IE.
>We know some words (perhaps), but there is nothing that really >really
>relates to any other known language, and until the unlikely >day we find a
>Rosetta Stone, it will probably remain this way. Some respectable scholars
>have speculated about a relationship to >IE, but this is just speculative
>(something to do with verbs, as I >recall).
So, Mark, what will REALLY REALLY relate the two languages in your mind
then? What you say is what the Enc.Britt. dishes out but then as Piotr
reminds, the Enc.Britt. can be outdated at times. It looks like I will have
to get medieval with your heiney and state a long list of hard Etruscan=IE
parallels that I'm aware of:
mi "I" *me
in "it" *e
zal "two" *dwe-
ca "this" *ke (Lat cis)
ta "this" *to
-s [nom.] *-s
-s,-sa,-si [gen.] *-es
-l, -al [gen.] (cf. Anatolian)
-n, -ni [acc.] *-m
-un [gen.] *-om
-c "and" *kwe
-m, -um "and" (Hittite -ma)
-thi, ti "in" *dhi
-pi "at, in, by" *bhi
-th [imperative] *dhi
-thas [past part] *-tos
-anas [perf part] *-nos
usil "sun" (Aurora, Eos, Usah...)
laucane "shining" *luk-
acnaice "guide" *ag- "to lead"
hanthin "in front of" (Hittite hanti)
hinthin "below" ? *ndheri
sane "ancestor" *sen- "grow old"
math "honey" *medhus
lautni "family" *leudhos "people"
tins "day" *din-
vers "fire" *wer- "to burn"
ar- "to make, do" *er- "plow"
mac- "to magnify" *megh- "be big"
sat- "to sit" *sed-
sac- "to consecrate" *sak-
car- "to make" *kwer-
caz- "sharp" *kwedh-
tam-,tham- "to build" (Latin domus)
tarc- "to observe" *derk-
mur- "to remain" *mor-
Some of my thoughts:
-r, -ar [pl] = IE *-es (IndoEtruscan *-ec)
-ce,-che [past] = *-ske- [repetitive]
thezin-ce = *dhidhah- "to place"
cealch "30" < ci "3" + al [adjectival]
+ IEtr *dekam, kam "ten"
(IE *dekm)
cezp "8" < ci(s) "3" + phi "by"
lit. "three alongside (five)"
nurph "9" = IE *newn + -phi "by"
In fact, taking the words /sane/ "deceased" and /sac-/ "to consecrate" for a
moment, we might notice that there is no way that the Etruscans might have
loaned these word from surrounding Latin (sanctus, sacere, senex??). To
boot, there are derivatives like /sacni/ "priest". How could Etruscan
preserve the /h-/ in hanthin if it's all loans?
A site for Etruscan is set up at:
http://www.muw.edu/~rmccalli/EtruscanU.html
It also lists a term "un" = "for you". If true, it might relate to *yusme -
Just a thought. If this doesn't help you, Mark, then I can't nurture your
madness.
- gLeN
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