Re: human/chimp oral differences

From: Gerry Reinhart-Waller
Message: 1525
Date: 2000-02-16

Marc Verhaegen wrote:
>
> >> >> >> >Glen, could you possibly explain what the problem is with the
> tongue and vocal cords of chimps?
>
> >> >> >> Nothing! In fact they're quite tasty with a little wine sauce,
> simmered over a low heat. But putting high-brow cuisine aside (or should I
> say tongue-and-cheek cuisine), they simply don't have the ability to speak
> like us because of their anatomy. That's probably all that's keeping chimps
> from fully replacing the workers at AT&T. :) - gLeN
>
> >> >> >Er, Glen, I thought you had said that the anatomy of chimp and
> human was similar regarding tongue and vocal cords. Or are you saying that
> the anatomy is different? But my question is: is the difference great
> enough to prevent the chimp from speaking? Gerry 2/13/99
>
> >> >> Gerry, there are a lot of differences in oral anatomy between humans &
> chimps, eg, humans have everted lips, a smaller mouth, less prognathism, a
> highly vaulted palate, a smooth palate vault, a round tongue, a descended os
> hyoid & larynx. Moreover, the cerebral control in humans is about twice that
> in chimps (area 4) and the coordination of area 4 by the prefrontal areas is
> much better developed in humans (eg, area 44 or Broca). Yes, these
> differences are great enough to prevent them from speaking. Marc
>
> >> >Thanks Marc. That's the explanation I was looking for. And it was so
> succinctly worded as well. So although chimps can be taught wrote tasks,
> the chimp will never speak a "Nostratic" language. Correct? Gerry
> 2/14/00
>
> >> Correct. Marc
>
> >And Marc, why will chimps never be able to speak a Nostratic language? Is
> it because of their hard wiring or because they don't have a template
> imbedded in their brain? IOW, are you pro or anti Chomsky? Gerry
> 2/15/00
>
> Chomsky has fabricated difficult generative "rules", which don't explain
> anything. I prefer linguists like Greenberg & Comrie & Dik. But I don't see
> what this has to do with chimps. Chimps don't have our enlarged area 4
> (precentral areas) for the control over the fine movements of the oral
> cavity, they lack our coordination of these areas by area 44 (Broca), they
> have a rather different anatomy of the mouth & throat (see above), probably
> they have different & smaller temporal areas for the analysis of speech
> sounds, and they lack our enlarged association areas in the brain. Raised in
> a human family & after years of training they can't say more than 3 or 4
> different "words". Besides that, I don't think there is a sharp difference
> in biological neural systems between hard & soft ware (IOW, I don't know
> what you mean by "template").
>
> Marc
>

Hi Marc, your answer is very concise and very biological which it should
be. But language acquisition isn't only that which is biological. Part
of language has a cultural factor. But another, perhaps less well
explained factor and absolutely one that is difficult to document, goes
beyond biological and cultural. And whatever we call this factor (I'm
not even sure what Chomsky calls it) it is responsible for the inherited
knowledge that we receive. And this is what I am referring to as
template. This template in our brains is a type of language map that
allows infants to contextualize the word patterns and associations, to
understand the syntax of her particular (native) language, and place the
grammar of a particular languge in its appropriate place. Without this
template humans would be no different from chimps or gorillas. Also,
within the human populations, some folks have a better defined template
than do others.

Does this make sense?

Gerry
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Gerald Reinhart
Independent Scholar
(650) 321-7378
waluk@...
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