From: Piotr Gasiorowski
Message: 1014
Date: 2000-01-20
----- Original Message -----From: Simona KlemencicSent: Thursday, January 20, 2000 9:42 AMSubject: [cybalist] Kraina vs. Kranjsko
Piotr writes: > Carniola (Kranjska; we know it as Kraina "The Country" in Poland) is one >of the three historical parts of Slovenia (please correct me Simona if I'm >wrong), but certainly not the least important one. There's a well-known >race of the European honey bee which is called the Carniola Honey Bee. >Doesn't it sound sweet, Mark? Simona comments: You're right about one thing. Personally, being from Styria I don't really feel like a member of the Kranjsko or Kranjska part of this country. But these things are quite remoted now and we probably feel the name Carniola or Carinthia as slightly exotic, just like Mark said. But there's this: if I've got you right, you are comparing the Polish word kraina with the Slovene word Kranjsko. I think that the word kraina, like Slovene pokrajina, is of Slavic origine, derived from the word kraj' ('place, spot', later also 'end'). Kranjsko, on the other hand, is a pre-Slavic name (Carnia). Some think that it derives from the Celtic carn 'horn'<pie.*ak' 'a sharp stone'. It's also possible that the origine of this name is a substratum word for a rock or stone, *kar(r)a-, related to the Illyrian-Venetan karuant- 'rocky, stony'. SimonaI was just glossing the Polish name, not etymologising Kranjsko itself. It's obvious (ESPECIALLY in the light of Latin Carni-) that they are different words. I suppose once upon a time some naive Slavs from the north were misguided by the phonetic similarity between *Karnj- (metathesised to Kranj-) and their own kraj, kraina/kraniec 'place, country/end, borderland' etc. (cf. Ukraine) and perhaps confused Kranjska with Krajina as well. I regret this historical mistake. I'd much prefer something like *Krań or *Krania to have become the Polish name. It would sound far more exotic; Kraina sounds like no name at all. But nobody asked a linguist's opinion :-(Piotr