Re: RE : Goliath and Uriah the Hittite as IE

From: Ivanovas/Milatos
Message: 440
Date: 1999-12-06

Hi Brent,
you asked:
>is there any IE tie into the name Nepholim, Anakites, Emites, Rephaites,
>Zamzumities or any of the other giant peoples purported by the Jews?
>Is there any IE mythology about Gods creating GIANT heroes

There is a gigantic hero of the Anatolian coast even, called 'Anax' (a word
supposedly going back to an original 'wanax', documented in Mycenaean
Greek/Lin.B as wa-na-ka). He was the son of Uranos and Ge (heaven and earth)
and autochthonic (inborn) king and eponymos (name-giving person) of
Anaktoria, later Miletus (Caria, today western Turkey), father of (one of
the kings by the name of) Asterios, also king in Miletus, who was killed by
Miletos (son of Apollo with a Cretan goddess) and fled to Caria to conquer
the town that then got his name. Asterios was buried on a small island near
Lade (that's just outside Miletus, then in the sea, now silted up and a
hill). His skeleton was supposed to have been at least ells long (when it
was found in antiquity). Cf. Robert Graves, Greek myths, 88/b and /3, where
he also makes the connection with the Anakim of Genesis).
This is interesting when seen in an archaeological light. In the past few
years the parts of Miletus dating before Greek and Mycenaean times have been
systematically excavated by the German Prof. W.D. Niemeier (cf. his article
on the sea peoples and on Tell Kabri I mentioned in the sea people mail,
there is also a newer one on 'Minoan Frescoes in the Eastern Mediterranean'
in Aegeum 18, 1998). Niemeier found a clearly Minoan layer below the
Mycenaean one, including pottery (local, Minoan style, e.g. conical cups),
bits of frescoes (Minoan style: white lily on red ground) and a sherd of a
large local vase inscribed with Linear A signs (as I said). Not far from the
ancient island- nowaydays hill - of Lade is another hill where in the
beginning of the century typical Mycenaean graves were found (as near
Ephesos, Aphrodisias and other places near the Anatolian coast lately).
Miletus is quite certainly the Millawanda of the Hittites.
As for the etymology of 'wanax' (usually translated as king but still under
debate, see the discussion of specialists on AEGEANET, summer 1999) there is
an interesting hypothesis by E. Brown in the article I mentioned in my
earlier mail on Luvian in Troy (Linear A on Trojan Spindlewhorls etc.). I
cite:
"the pre-forms of Greek γυνή ('gynH') and Luvian 'wana-' with its extended
form 'wanatti-' (syncopated 'unatti-'), whose meaning is 'woman' or 'lady',
have a common Indo-European root." the he continues in a footnote: "For the
Luvian preforms, PIE and Proto-Anatolian (*gwnéh2-, *gweneh2-, *gwóná-), see
Melchert 1994 (Anatolian Historical Phonology, Amsterdam and Atlanta), 264
and 1993(Cuneiform Luvian Lexicon. Chapel Hill) 36-37 with bibliography
there. /.../ The very notion that we might one day succeed in showing Linear
A to have been created at a stage in the evolution of Luvian when the
initial voiced labiovelar of Proto-Anatolian *gwona- had become /w/ but
before /o/ had become /a:/ in 'wana-' must be relegated to a footnote. Yet
the idea that the Mycenaeans must have borrowed their signary at a
substantially earlier date than their first preserved writings is not new
and helps explain the still unschematized form in which some of the Linear B
signs became fixed, forms more archaic in fact than their Linear A
counterparts."

So (w-)Anax 'Lord' (in a sacral context!) probably goes back to Anatolian
'wana-' Lady!
And people using this name (theonym?)once may have been those who lived e.g.
in Miletus where myth still tells us about them, in this case historically
referring either to Mycenaean or Minoan times (hardly any other traces
there), if the latter, then clearly using an Anatolian-based language
similar to Luvian but written with Linear A signs (Minoan?).
Very interesting indeed.
Sabine